Stick, Balsa or Avon?

[misterlewis]

Hi all

Going to the Derwent at Sutton this week. Really fancy a day of trotting for a change.

Just wondered, as it's pretty deep in the section above the road bridge, would you use a stick (if so, then shirt button or bulk shot), a bigger model like a balsa or an Avon type?

Also, would you plumb to dead depth and then hold back slightly to lift the bait above the bottom or fish higher up in the water or does it just depend on the day and how I'm loose feeding.

Spent too many years sitting behind buzzers on gravel pits so a refresher would be great if anyone has the time.

Cheers

Chris

[NickLynch]

Personally i'd fish a metal stem stick with shirt button shot, and definitely plumb the depth. I'd find dead depth then drop down an inch every run(because of the bow in the line) untill you catch the bottom. Try feeding for 10-20 mins before your first cast.

[misterlewis]

Hi Nick

Thanks for that. Sounds good.

I read Dave Harrells article on stick fishing last night and he recommends a float carrying a no.4 for every foot of water so it's going to be a chunky float!

Thanks again for your advice, really appreciate it mate.

I intended setting up a feeder rod too so I might give that 10 or 12 quick casts on the float line to get a bit of bait down on the bottom and then, as you suggested, 20 mins of steady loosefeeding before the first trot through. I can revert to the feeder rig when i need a coffee and fag break

I'll report back with how I get on

Cheers

Chris

[mojo101986]

Just a tip, instead of crashing a feeder into the swim a dozen times invest in a bait dropper, you'll get easily as much bait down with a few casts and wont disrupt the swim as much

[crofton blade]

And just to be different, if its deep then I'd use bulk shot about 2/3 of way down then shirt button down to the hooklength with number 4s. Or if its slow paced use a waggler/ slider if its really deep.
I've caught plenty of dace today by loosefeeding and fishing a waggler about 2 feet deep so that might be worth a go too.

[misterlewis]

Thanks lads

Really appreciate all of the input. Going tomorrow. Can't wait!!!

Hopefully I'll get at least a few bits but really hoping for a few roach and/ or chub.

Cheers

Chris

[Phil Arnott]

I fish it that area a lot. I always use big float and bulk shot with about a 30in hook length and one shot below probably a no4 or 6 but you can vary this. I don't think the float is too critical provided it takes a fair amount of shot and you just have the tip showing. You want to get the float settled as quickly as possible. Strung shot and stick floats are best under 8ft depth. See what Dave Harrell recommends for a depth of 16ft.

I fish mostly with the bait tripping the bottom. If you don't get the bait down quickly or fish up in the water you usually get bothered with bleak and small dace. The problem is the depth, you will have to use a sliding float or a 18/20ft rod. You can also fish a pole and flat float. The alternative is a feeder which won't bother the fish, you'll be fishing in 15-18 ft in most places even more in winter.

There's quite a few perch so take some worms but not many chub although I've had them to 4lb+. Bream show up now and again but it's mainly roach, perch and with a few dace and ruffe.

I use heavy ground bait or a dropper to get feed down quickly, Don't loose feed it's too deep with too many small fish up in the water also when there's a decent current your bait won't reach the bottom anywhere near you.

[misterlewis]

Report.......

Fished 10.30-4.30. It was so slow and deep that I ended up fishing a 2.5AAA waggler with a bulk at half depth and then No.6's and a No.8 dropper a foot from the hook. 2.5lb Maxima mainline, 18 hook to 1.5lb bottom. I set up at dead depth and tried to just get the bait tripping bottom about 1.5-2 rodlengths out. Plenty of regular loosefeed beforehand and a small pouchful every cast.

Bit of a slow start but ended up really happy with my meagre catch. 2 of nearly everything!! 2 little dace, 2 perch, 2 bleak and 2 ruffe. Missed a few bites and lost a couple of fish. Never mind the stats though, just a pleasure to be away from work on such a lovely day in a lovely spot.

I also had the good fortune to make the acquaintance of Phil Arnott, really good to meet you Phil. Great to get a masterclass from such an experienced (and successful) angler who seemed to know every place I've ever fished! Phil, I only wish I'd read your post before I set off!! Sage advice which I shall certainly employ next time (Sunday hopefully)
Finances won't stretch to a nice 20' rod so I'll try the slider. I'd best get on youtube and learn how to tie a sliding stop knot then!!!
OR... rods and 2 feeders on 2 lines. 1 right down the middle and one to a feature (overhang/ bridge buttress etc). What do you think?

Thanks again for all the advice

Cheers

Chris

[BOF]

Its been a long time since I fished a float, but I've always run with a rule of thumb for float selection that has it that Stick floats are for water up to 6-8ft deep with a really steady flow, (which because of the shirt button shot pattern are terrible to cast in any way but an underarm swing), Avon floats which carry all their bulk shot about 2-3ft from the hook, (so they are for water in excess of 4-5 ft and can be cast further out), also they are for faster flow with the odd "boil". Anything deeper ie 8ft+ and I use a Balsa, either fixed or as a Slider, (although finding big sliders these days is very difficult). These can be cast reasonable distances without too many tangles, as, like the Avon float, their shot pattern is grouped low down near the hook.

Hope this helps.

BOF

[Beauregard]

BOF, if you're struggling to find big sliders

(although finding big sliders these days is very difficult)

, try these :Maver Antenna Slider Floats - Ted Carter

[beachball]

Oct 1, 2014 12:39:07 GMT Beauregard said:

BOF, if you're struggling to find big sliders

(although finding big sliders these days is very difficult)

, try these :Maver Antenna Slider Floats - Ted Carter

Whats wrong with the polaris lockslide floats? is it because there is to much flow in a river?
I was thinking of using one of these as a float ledger on the carp/course social best regards Malc

[Beauregard]

Whats wrong with the polaris lockslide floats? is it because there is to much flow in a river?
I was thinking of using one of these as a float ledger on the carp/course social best regards Malc

Nothing wrong, in my mind, with Polaris type floats on Still-water or slow moving Rivers when fishing stationary.
The original question was about "Trotting" a deep swim on a river. I've used the Dave Thomas Locslide small No1 waggler www.floatsonline.co.uk/locslide_peacock_leger_float.php to good effect for tench when fishing a peg that shelves between 6 to 12 feet.

[BOF]

The difficulty I have with those floats is as soon as they are held back against the flow they go under, whereas the Balsa Sliders I refer to have a much thicker body, and a second ring up near the tip, which allows more control of the float.



Hope that is clear.

BOF

[Beauregard]

You could always make your own

[jerseyman]

Map ,possibly ultra used to make them Bof, but as you say RHS to find, even the York shops don't have them.

I see what you are explaining BG, but you will eventually tear the eye out of the shoulder striking, the more robust ones tend to either be whipped, as in Bofs piccy ,or the twin wire of the eye[better "slide"] is bent at 75/80 degrees and slid down the shoulder of the float and glued. The use of a waggler attachment ,is possible, but you will find the float slides far better with the bottom eye at 90 degrees to the float
Also ,IMHO, if you use a all balsa float, you will have a smaller float /bigger shot capacity than modifying a big stick float.
Interesting and rewarding fishing a slider, especially in flowing water, sadly a much forgotten tactic in these days of feeders and poles, but again, only my opinion

[Phil Arnott]

Some of the York anglers use sliding floats for fishing on the Ouse and they will know more about slider fishing than I do so ask around. Having looked at one pattern they were made of a length of peacock quill with a small cane insert in the bottom and the usual top and bottom eye. At one time you could buy the eyes and I think I cleared York Tackle out of them however it may be worth asking about in York. There was a very small diameter eye under 0.5mm dia. which was specifically made for the top eye of sliders. I still have some of these but they are too rare to part with. It is possible to use a straightened out eyed hook but they will rust eventually.